report on SDHC use on ONE XL-S

[Gilbert]

I can confirm my new TopRam 4GB SDHC works well on my ONE XL-S.

I bought it on eBay from eTechIsland (kofkl) because nowhere could I find such a card of that capacity and speed in Montreal and came with a USB adapter at around 18$US before shipment thru "Buy it now" option.

Before installing the new card, I updated my XL-S thru TT Home with the latest quickfix and MapShare updates. Then I backed up. The card came formatted FAT32 and was empty. I restored the backup to my new card and it worked without a hitch. It seemed quicker in the bootup process and routing function although I did not measure the old timing vs the new.

When I reconnected, TT Home requested additional files to be downloaded to operate with the new inserted card. In the XL-S, adding a new SD card makes the internal memory disappear, it does not supplement the internal memory and one needs to copy the whole internal memory to the SD card as it will take over. Once connected to TT Home, with the SD card inserted, the internal memory becomes invisible.

I was curious as to the possible hype about the speed and did the following experiment. With the card is inserted in my XL-S, I copied a 100,431,872 Byte file to the SD card. It took about 2:40 for the complete copy operation. I deleted the file from the SD card and disconnected the GPS. I removed the SD card and inserted it in the supplied USB adapter and copied the same file to the SD card which took about 25 seconds or around 4MB/s writing. I then was curious about its read speed. I changed to an empty directory on my hard drive (Seagate ST3500630AS SATA) and copied the same file and it took 15 seconds to finish meaning over 6MB/sec reads. I agree it's not 22,5MB/sec writing for the SD card but surely faster than the internal memory of the XL-S. Depending on the internal interface of the XL-S to the SD card, it could theoretically load the system of 5,8MB under a second... Now remains the question of why the card is much slower when connected to the GPS than when connected straight to the USB adapter?

Hoping this will be useful to someone.

PS. One could argue that this card is an SD and not SDHC. From the ample reading I did, 4GB SD cards are rare and formatted FAT16 with large cluster size where the SDHC cards are all formatted FAT32 which was the case with my TopRam.

 

[Birdman]

Good post....thanks for sharing.

I find it very curious how many users are able to get SDHC cards working on their units...I saw another post of a user with a GO that used a 16GB SDHC card.

I say this is curious because the following except is taken DIRECTLY from the TomTom website....according to them, SDHC isn't supported. I would love to try a very high capacity SDHC card in my LE, but I don't want to be stuck with a card I cannot use.
>>> TomTom.com <<<

--------------------------------------

Question
Which memory card should I buy for additional maps?

Answer

TomTom GO 510/300, GO, ONE and RIDER come with a pre-installed memory card (SD card) containing everything you need to navigate.

If you need to install an additional map on a new memory card, we advise that you choose a memory card with enough memory to store your maps and any additional information such as applications, voice files, points of interest, etc.



The performance of your TomTom device depends on various factors:

* Make sure you have the latest application version installed.
* Try reducing the amount of selected Points of Interest (POI) to see if that improves performance.
* A memory card with a higher read speed may improve performance.



What memory cards are available?
SD Card TomTom GO/ONE/RIDER
TomTom NAVIGATOR 6
TomTom NAVIGATOR 5

Mini-SD Card TomTom NAVIGATOR 6

SDHC Card not supported



Read speed

We recommend that you buy a memory card with the highest available read speed.
Note: Some manufacturers express the speed in x 150 bytes/sec
Example: ?50 X? is equivalent to 7.5 MB/sec

 

[Gilbert]

Birdman,

I knew of that compatibility table which differs slightly in different TT regional sites but had seen no direct mention for the XL-S.

I have a hunch which would need to be verified. The standard for SD says they have to be formatted FAT16 and the standard for SDHC says they have to be formatted FAT32. Since the internal memory on my XL-S was FAT32, it led me to the conclusion it might well be compatible with SDHC. Could this be the hint as to SDHC compatibility? If people check the FAT format of the internal memory, we may have something to verify here... This is more of a plausible theory than factual knowledge of chipsets and part numbers. I admit I was apprehensive of the compatibility of that card in my XL-S as I know standards are not always followed to the "t". My experience in manufacturing tells me that when the design and engineering people have achieved the last stage and production people look at suppliers, sometime the availability and price change over time and the costlier parts may become cheaper than what used to be. Since SDHC is becoming the norm and the XL-S is the most recent, one might think it may have been more pratical to use the newer and often cheaper part, the SDHC over the regular SD. It often happens this way in the electronics field which moves so fast!

 

[SShadow]

Checked him out on eBay, but he's currently listing nothing but 16gb SDHC.

 

[Gilbert]

I thought I would update a little on the subject due to recent experiences...

While the card operates real fine when connected with the supplied USB adapter, when connected within the TT unit thru the cable and doing updates thru Home, I do get problems. I have yet to have a problem with writing the Quick Fix files but do get problems writing the MapShare updates. I need to do a chkdsk on the card attached with the supplied USB adapter which tells me of problems then do a chkdsk with the /f option which corrects the file problem on the card. Usually, when connected back with the card in the TT system, the second update will take place with success. If not, I need to remove the card, put it in the supplied adapter, chkdsk before reinserting the SDHC card in the TT system and repeat the MapShare update process in Home... The other alternative is to update only internal memory and then update the SDHC card when connected to its own adapter.

When the TT system is in the car, with the SDHC card in, I can dump screens without problem and have checked each dump (about 16) and they were written fine. The problems occur when the TT is attached thru the USB cable.

I have learned more about the USB interface in TT systems from specs about the Samsung integrated chipsets. TT uses two different ones: S3C2412 used in TT ONE variants and S3C2443 used in the x20 and new x30. By integrated chipset, I mean nearly the whole pnd functions: CPU, memory, controllers for display, GPS, sounds, clock etc. The S3C2412 has the USB v1.1 standard vs the S3C2443 that uses the v2 standard. The v1.1 USB standard means all access will be very slow and I am surprised a current chipset still uses this rather old standard. That explains the differences in transfer results when attached thru the supplied USB SD adapter and when connected within the TT system. Communication between the system and the card does not seem similarly affected.

Considering the price (about 20$US plus shipping) I paid including the USB adapter, I can't complain but people need to be aware of those limitations and the hassle it implies.

ps. SShadow seems lost in a snowbank, haven't heard from him since the 3rd.... ;-)

 

[Gilbert]

A new update is in order... When I updated to Home 2.3.0.70 there was a nice surprise! I can put my SDHC card in its SDHC adapter and it is recognized by Home as another TT memory which can be selected. This means updates are made directly to the SDHC card without needing to go thru the USB cable and old v1.1 USB interface. This means no more writing problems so far and very fast too.

I can also choose internal memory when it is connected with the USB cable. I cannot choose both at the same time...

I have not read anything from x20 or x30 users about this new Home feature and may be exclusive to ONE models because the whole internal memory content needs to be on the SDHC card which may be why it is recognized as TT by Home.

As for the 4GB memory write maximum, I assume it would be removed because the access is now done differently, probably simply using the MS XP drivers. I would be curious to hear from others on this.

 

[Smokiewolf]

A new update is in order... When I updated to Home 2.3.0.70 there was a nice surprise! I can put my SDHC card in its SDHC adapter and it is recognized by Home as another TT memory which can be selected. This means updates are made directly to the SDHC card without needing to go thru the USB cable and old v1.1 USB interface. This means no more writing problems so far and very fast too.

I can also choose internal memory when it is connected with the USB cable. I cannot choose both at the same time...

I have not read anything from x20 or x30 users about this new Home feature and may be exclusive to ONE models because the whole internal memory content needs to be on the SDHC card which may be why it is recognized as TT by Home.

As for the 4GB memory write maximum, I assume it would be removed because the access is now done differently, probably simply using the MS XP drivers. I would be curious to hear from others on this.

So, that HC card works in your ONE XL-S?

 

[Gilbert]

So, that HC card works in your ONE XL-S?

Sure does! Of course, the USB standard v1.1 when linked with the USB cable imposes limits when the card is in the XL-S but with the adapter, which came with my card, it just flies. I would go so far as recommending it on the condition one buys it with the adapter. I can't say for sure that greater size than 4GB would be recommandable as others, on x20 systems, have had some problems with 8GB, Home and linked to USB cable. I suspect the problem is there: the USB cable and Home accessing it thru the USB cable. There is also the unknown, for greater than 4GB SDHC cards, of the writing capability of the TT system such as can be proven with screen dumps.

To get back on the aspect of recommanding the 4GB SDHC on ONE systems, it greatly improves backup and writing times. The whole backup and restore times are greatly improved and warrant the price I paid for it. If an XL-S owner wants additional maps or computer languages, the additional space is quite nice to have. No need to delete what is installed.

 

[Smokiewolf]

Can you post a pic of the adaptor? How does that work?

 

[Gilbert]

Can you post a pic of the adaptor? How does that work?

I'll give you the url: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=130191033541

BTW, I don't necessarily recommend this provider. Since he does not read his mail, he ended up giving me problems that should not have occured in the first place. I had not bought anything from eBay for a few years and my PayPal account needed to be updated with my CR card new expiry date etc. I used the buy it now option and was under the impression I could use my CR card. When I realized I could not do so, there was no provision to go back to payment method. I ordered a second time after updating my PayPal account and wrote to cancel my first order with all the details both in the contact the dealer and in in an email within an hour of the first order. My 2nd order was sent 3 days after payment was cleared and three months later received a notice to pay for my first order or get a bad reputation. This was cleared but prefer warning people...

The adaptor is about the size of a cigarette lighter with covers for both ends (usb and SDHC card slot). It is made out of plastic and not very rugged but it works right and, as you can see, not something expensive.

 

[Smokiewolf]

So, you take the card out of the unit, and use it in this adapter with HOME, then put it back into the unit?

 

[Gilbert]

So, you take the card out of the unit, and use it in this adapter with HOME, then put it back into the unit?

Exactly. As I wrote previously, the USB cable is cause for a slowdown in transfers and large writes, at least in Home, can prove troublesome with FAT32 errors. You can see the numbers for writing and reading speed in my first post with comparison between using the USB cable and the SDHC adapter. When I wrote that, I was not aware of the Samsung integrated chipset that TT uses and was not aware of the USB v1.1 of all ONE models. I ended up at the Samsung website and downloaded the pdf on their mobile products.

 

[Smokiewolf]

Oh, ok. I think I get it. My understanding was that even if you could get the data onto a card, that the HC cards simply wouldn't work. You're saying that writing the data on the card when it's in the unit is the problem, and as long as you can write the data on the card using that adaptor, it works fine in the unit. Do I have it right?

 

[Gilbert]

Oh, ok. I think I get it. My understanding was that even if you could get the data onto a card, that the HC cards simply wouldn't work. You're saying that writing the data on the card when it's in the unit is the problem, and as long as you can write the data on the card using that adaptor, it works fine in the unit. Do I have it right?

Exactly! Only when in the unit and having Home wanting to write to the SDHC card was there problems. Never had a problem when using the SDHC card adaptor. So when Home (newest version) allowed the card to be accessed with the adapter, I was really happy as the limitation was removed. One can even have the internal memory shown with one letter and the SDHC card will show with another letter and home will ask which memory it should access: the internal memory or the SD card?

The only other writing access is the TT system that wants to write to the card such as screen dumps, changing Home coordinates, adding favorites that all write to the SDHC card to MapSettings.ini file was done without problems as I mentioned previously.

 

[Smokiewolf]

Interesting. Now I really wish we could use the NA maps on our ONEs

 

[Gilbert]

Interesting. Now I really wish we could use the NA maps on our ONEs

With the limited internal memory, you could not even load the imbedded POI.DAT and CRPOI.DAT files of around 460MB into the ONE models. Even the 930 models, with their 4GB internal memory, are starting to prove too small for the large European and NA maps with their respective speech recognition files. I predict the newer models (after the x30) will either have more memory or TT will reduce the map details or remove one map for their respective EU or NA markets. I would not be surprised to see a map removed... Since they don't seem to want to offer the latest European map to their NA customers, I would not be surprised to see one map removed.

I'm surprised to see Guam offered. I would have expected Hawai or Puerto Rico but Guam? How many US citizens have gone there outside of army service? Living in Canada, I've never seen a vacation to Guam offered by travel agencies! I had heard of the name but could not have located it on a world map easily... I know a lot of world travellers but none of them have yet been to Guam.

 

[dhn]

It is being reported that, for Europeans, TomTom is providing voice recognition files only for their European map but noth their NA map on 930's while North American purchasers are experiencing the opposite (can get VR only for their NA map, not european).

 

[Blister72]

Handy info...hate slow copy/ install times!

This sounds like what I do with my PSP and its Pro Duo card. I just pop the card out of the back of the PSP (forget the USB cable hook up) and just move files about from the PC to the card in the multi-card reader. Muy Rapido!

I am so sick I could spit fire anytime I have to download even the Susan computer voice, let alone USA_Canada 715, after a total format of my unit, which I pray I never have to do again soon.

Last night all I had on my unit was the Guam map. WTF?!? I agree, who on earth needs a Guam map?!? Don't throw it in even for free, it just causes problems if it is selected and takes up valuable drive space.

Maybe it is some Tomtom tourism effort to draw more vacationers, those that get one, to Guam. I've never seen a Guam vacation commercial either. LOL!

 

[Westham]

I'll give you the url: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=130191033541

BTW, I don't necessarily recommend this provider. Since he does not read his mail, he ended up giving me problems that should not have occured in the first place. I had not bought anything from eBay for a few years and my PayPal account needed to be updated with my CR card new expiry date etc. I used the buy it now option and was under the impression I could use my CR card. When I realized I could not do so, there was no provision to go back to payment method. I ordered a second time after updating my PayPal account and wrote to cancel my first order with all the details both in the contact the dealer and in in an email within an hour of the first order. My 2nd order was sent 3 days after payment was cleared and three months later received a notice to pay for my first order or get a bad reputation. This was cleared but prefer warning people...

The adaptor is about the size of a cigarette lighter with covers for both ends (usb and SDHC card slot). It is made out of plastic and not very rugged but it works right and, as you can see, not something expensive.

I have read this thread with great interest, it took me forever to download the western europe map via the cable onto a 2GB SD Card (a Patiot 133 speed fastest card fry's electronic super store had at the time )I wish I had waited a little longer and read your thread and purchase the 4 GB and adaptor you mention...........perhaps I'll purchase one and relaod it anyway that way I will have a spare when I visit England and France this summer.
Thanks

 

[Gilbert]

I have read this thread with great interest, it took me forever to download the western europe map via the cable onto a 2GB SD Card (a Patiot 133 speed fastest card fry's electronic super store had at the time )I wish I had waited a little longer and read your thread and purchase the 4 GB and adaptor you mention...........perhaps I'll purchase one and relaod it anyway that way I will have a spare when I visit England and France this summer.
Thanks

What I appreciate with the card in its adaptor is that I can experiment to my heart's content in a speedy way. Even doing a full backup of the card is not so bad when compared to doing it with the internal memory. I use Total Commander for all my file operations and with the twin side by side windows can compare by content, see the file sizes and dates, copy move, archive, delete, modify file names and/or content, search for files or text constants, open a command window execute a POI reader, point to a file for which I have a plugin and see the file's characteristics without opening it (usefull for knowing the .dll or .exe version, mp3 bit rate, duration, artist etc.). When both the SD card and the internal memory are connected to my PC, I can just move the ?ephem? folder from the just updated SD card to the internal memory and it is done without needing to get back in Home to change external drive letter and going thru the update process again. I also feel I have a better knowledge of the system's structure and files.

I'd suggest to you to put your TT in your carry in bag and have a good backup of your TT system before leaving. You probably also are aware of the availability of radar ov2 files for your destinations... Speeding fines can ruin a travel budget!