XXL - Can't connect to satellites

[MikeRivers]

I was given a non-working XXL (540, I think). It never finds any satellites, just displays a New York City map with what looks like a bunch of POIs on it. I've left it powered up all day, right next to my other two TomToms, which consistently acquire five or six satellites in a few minutes.

I updated it, and that didn't fix the problem. I restored what was there before updating, and it still didn't work. All the software functions seem to be working properly. I can enter a destination and it seems like it would take me there if only it knew where it was. On the "Busy planning route" screen, it only says "Waiting for a valid GPS signal." When I access the "GPS Status" screen, the little yellow circle with the black triangles is rotating, suggesting that the software is working hard at finding satellites. It says "Poor GPS Reception - are you inside a building?"

I've done the fullest reset I know of - holding down the power button until the screen flashes green, then it restarts with a screen with info on the version and build of the software. That doesn't help.

The battery has been dead for an undetermined length of time, perhaps years, but it takes and holds a charge. Is there some firmware that could get lost with a totally dead battery that isn't restored with an update?

It's almost like everything is working except the receiver. Is there a diagnostic for this that I could run? Is it ready for the dumpster? It's out of warranty of course and is on the "not repairable" list.

I'd like to get it working if possible.

 

[canderson]

Holding down the power button until you get the white on black diagnostic screen isn't helpful. To properly reboot, you want to release the button as soon as you hear the drums and see the logo.

It is possible that the device has a bogus ephemeris file that is preventing a new one from taking its place.

Connect device and let Home start up.
When/if Home suggests any further updates, hit "Back".
Minimize, but do not close, Home.

Using your PC, go to folder ON the device called "ephem". Delete any content inside that folder.
If at least one your other two TomTom units use Home, we won't bother with files on your PC for now.

Now, bring Home back to the fore, and select Update my device.
You should be offered a fresh QuickGPSfix. Go ahead and update just that file.

Using either the blue arrow in the lower right corner, or the Device/Disconnect Device option at the top, logically disconnect your 540 from your PC.
After the "Device disconnect" message, go ahead and disconnect the device.
Once it's up and running after the reboot, press and hold the power button UNTIL you hear drums / see logo.
Allow that reboot to complete.

How does it behave now?

 

[MikeRivers]

Thanks, but still no go. It doesn't offer the QuickGPSfix, and tells me there are no updates.

There wasn't much useful in the ephem folder, just two files
ee_meta.txt
ee_meta.tlv
Neither has any data. The .txt file contains only "Expiry=1429753944". Is that a date code that tells Home when it needs updating? The .tlv file is just text explaining what QuickGPSfix is.

I looked at the ephem folder on my XL, and it contained those same two files plus another one, cbee.cbee, which actually contains data. I tried copying that file into the XXL, and that didn't solve the problem either.

It still looks to me like the receiver just isn't working.

Are there any diagnostics available to us mortals?

 

[canderson]

OK. If no QuickGPSfix is offered, we'll need to remove them from your PC first. And based upon the fact that there are only two, those are REALLY old files.
So let's try removing them from your PC first.

Don't know what OS you are using, but we're looking for a folder called "TomTom \ HOME \ Download \ complete \ ephemeris"
Inside that folder, you will find one or more folders called "QuickGPSfix", "QuickGPSfix-1", "QuickGPSfix-2" etc. Delete all of those folders (not the ephemeris folder itself).

Try the process again. Not finding any ephemeris data anywhere on your PC or device, Home should offer to update it.

 

[MikeRivers]

I found the QuickGPSfix files on my computer, deleted them, connected to Home again, and this time it indeed downloaded the file to my computer. I couldn't find evidence that it installed anything new on the GPS, however. I extracted the data file (Ito.dat) from QuickGPSFix folder on the computer and copied it to the ephem folder on the GPS. Is that where it's supposed to be?

Anyway, the problem remains - not finding a GPS signal.

 

[canderson]

I'm beginning to wonder what unit Home thinks is connected. If it downloaded ephemeris data in response to connecting this particular XXL540, then it should have delivered that content to the device.

The steps you SHOULD have seen in Home were
. Download QuickGPSfix
. Install to Internal Memory
. Finishing installation

Did Home not show the "Installing" step after it downloaded the information?

No, just moving a single lto.dat file from the PC to the device isn't going to cut it. Further, when successful, I would expect the device's folder to contain cbee.cbee, ee_meta.tlv, ee_meta.txt and ito.dat files.

I am curious. When you got this unit and first fired up Home, did you provide a new email account for it? You didn't by some chance use the account of an older device that you already owned, did you? The address shown in the upper right corner of the Home screen must be unique to each device connected to Home.

 

[MikeRivers]

The steps you SHOULD have seen in Home were
. Download QuickGPSfix
. Install to Internal Memory
. Finishing installation

Did Home not show the "Installing" step after it downloaded the information?

I wasn't watching closely during the process, but the screen did say "Done" when I got back to it.

No, just moving a single lto.dat file from the PC to the device isn't going to cut it. Further, when successful, I would expect the device's folder to contain cbee.cbee, ee_meta.tlv, ee_meta.txt and ito.dat files.

The XL (that works fine) has in its ephem folder:
cbee.cbee
ee_meta.tiv
ee_meta.txt

I couldn't find ito.dat in it anywhere, either with a Windows search including hidden and system files, and my own search.

I was pretty sure that cbee.cbee was in the XXL ephem folder, either put there by a Home update or I copied it there, but when I looked just now, it wasn't there. I just put a copy of that file from the XL into that folder, and now I'll hook it up to Home and see if it goes away. . . .

After connecting to Home, selecting Update, and being told that the device is up to date, I checked the ephem folder and all four files are still there.

I am curious. When you got this unit and first fired up Home, did you provide a new email account for it?

Yes. When I first connected it, Home told me that the device connected wasn't the one associated with the account, so I created a new account, have been logging in to that account, and it's not complained since.

You didn't by some chance use the account of an older device that you already owned, did you? The address shown in the upper right corner of the Home screen must be unique to each device connected to Home.[/QUOTE]

I see the e-mail address that I used to create the account for the XXL in the upper right corner of the screen. The lower right corner identifies it as TomTom XXL, so, yes, I'm sure it's looking at the correct device.

So, to recap, the only way I've been able to get Home to tell me that there's an update (QuickGPSfix) is to delete the contents of the TomTom\HOME\download\complete\ephemeris folder in the computer. However, there's only QuickGPSfix and QuickGPSfix-1 folders (the -1 has newer files in it)Should there be a separate folder under the HOME folder for each device, the XL and the XXL? There's a separate folder for the ONE_3rd_Backup, but that's it.

I'm a hardware engineer, and this is really looking to me like a hardware problem. I wish there was a diagnostic I could load and run on it that would tell me if the receiver was working. If it's not, it'll never find the GPS signal.

 

[canderson]

Yes, two sets of ephemeris folders worth of files aren't atypical.
So the XL540 that is not working still does not have a complement of ephemeris files installed by Home?

One last shot ... Let's see what Home thinks is on the device.

Connect device and allow Home to open up.
Go to "Manage my XL" or whatever model Home is calling that unit. Should be on Home's page 2.
Using the "Items on device" tab, do you see QuickGPSfix Data (usually down towards the bottom)?
If not, one more time ..
Make sure that the ephemeris data from your other device is current. Copy all of the files from the ephem folder on that unit to the XXL540.
I don't know for certain what your working unit is (you didn't ever say other than 'xL'), so I can't be 100% sure of the result, but it can't get any worse.

If that doesn't cut it, then you may be right that there's a hardware issue here. I sent you through the above exercise because we HAVE seen that a bad ephemeris file will prevent new ones from updating, and a bad one will throw the unit off completely when it comes to projecting current satellite position.

 

[MikeRivers]

So the XL540 that is not working still does not have a complement of ephemeris files installed by Home?

Apparently not.

Connect device and allow Home to open up.
Go to "Manage my XL" or whatever model Home is calling that unit. Should be on Home's page 2.
Using the "Items on device" tab, do you see QuickGPSfix Data (usually down towards the bottom)?

Nope. At the top level, it lists:

Applications
Maps
Voices
Points of Interest
Fuel Prices
Safety Cameras
Color Schemes
Car Symbols
Startup Images
Shutdown Images

Now, I'll hook up the XL (it's a 340S-XL) and see if QuickGPSfix is listed for that, after first checking for updates.

Nope. Same list of items. However, when I looked at the "Install Items from your computer" tab, I saw QuickGPSfix. I didn't install it on the XL since it's working, but I'll run HOME on the XXL again and install it from there. When I checked for updates on the XL, Home said it was up to date.

OK - I installed QuickGPSfix from the computer to the XXL, Home said it was done, and now it appears on the list of "Items on the device." However, looking at the files on the XXL, I don't see cbee.cbee in the ephem folder.

Curiously (or maybe not) the cbee.cbee file on the XL seems to be time stamped (last modified) with the last time the device was started. It's a binary file with no intelligible text - I looked at it with a hex editor - in it so I can't tell if anything in the file itself has been changed.

If that doesn't cut it, then you may be right that there's a hardware issue here. I sent you through the above exercise because we HAVE seen that a bad ephemeris file will prevent new ones from updating, and a bad one will throw the unit off completely when it comes to projecting current satellite position.

My technical knowledge of GPS stops with the ones I worked with on navy oceanographic research ships in the 1970s. At that time, the ephermeris data wasn't essential, it was a helper that told the receiver approximately where satellites should be so it could start with a position based on that information. In theory, unless the TomTom simply won't work without that file, it should eventually pick up a signal, certainly within a few hours. And I know that satellites are visible from where it is since another TomTom right next to it is happy.

"In theory, theory and practice are the same, but in practice, mostly they aren't" - me

It doesn't seem that it's going to work after hammering on the software, but thanks for the suggestions and procedures. My other two TomToms have always worked so I've never explored very far into the files and what was and wasn't installed. Maybe what I've learned with your coaching will be useful some other time.

I saw something on the web site regarding units too old to repair that offered a loyal customer discount on a new unit. Maybe I can con them into selling me one map update for my XL for $25 instead of a year's subscription for $100. I'd been balking at a $100 map update since now a new GPS with free lifetime map updates costs just about $100. I was hoping that the XXL had a newer map than my XL. Oh, well.

Thanks.

 

[canderson]

Even if the 540 had a newer map, you definitely wouldn't have been able to copy it to your 340. They're keyed to individual unit serial numbers to curb pirating of maps.

Sorry it didn't work out for you. Was worth a shot. I've thought in the past (and it's been a few years since this came up) that an errant ephemeris file would load bad info into NVRAM that would only be replaced by a correct file. Had hoped that by providing the device with a clean load that it might overwrite anything still resident.

There is one oddball TomTom tool that we can recommend as a true last ditch effort. It's called ClearFlash. It removes things that you can't see regarding current configuration. You will want to execute this program THREE times You don't get anything resembling a real response from it -- nothing that indicates that it's actually done anything useful -- so don't be surprised by that. If it doesn't work, I'm afraid you are out of luck on this unit. Find attached.

 

[MikeRivers]

Even if the 540 had a newer map, you definitely wouldn't have been able to copy it to your 340. They're keyed to individual unit serial numbers to curb pirating of maps.

My plan was to retire the XL and use the XXL if it worked, not transfer the maps to the XL.

There is one oddball TomTom tool that we can recommend as a true last ditch effort. It's called ClearFlash. It removes things that you can't see regarding current configuration.

I've run that before, on my ONE-3rd. However, when I unZIPped the file you attached and run setup.exe, I get "No SETUP information found on disk or CD-ROM." This is with or without the device connected to the computer. Got a direct download link I can try?

 

[canderson]

Sorry. The setup was larger, so I assumed that was the correct file. It's actually the other one. Still ... Direct link >> http://us.support.tomtom.com/app/an...does-not-keep-its-settings.-what-should-i-do?

 

[MikeRivers]

Just to close this up . .

After trying the suggestions offered here, including a couple of rounds of re-installing the application, the problem escalated. After the last re-installation, the touch screen stopped responding. It displayed text and graphics, but tapping on a selection did nothing. After re-starting to get to the text information screen, I noticed that instead of displaying the XXL application, it now displayed ONE. Apparently it had picked up the wrong application to install.

Since I could no longer get a response when tapping on the "Connect to computer" button, I bit the bullet and made a phone call to Tom Tom Customer Support. I was pleasantly surprised to reach a representative with only a couple of minutes on hold.

I summarized the history of the problem to him, explained the current state, and asked if there was a way to clear everything out and start again. Turned out that, while time-consuming it was pretty easy. Even though it wouldn't connect to Home, it would connect to the computer as a removable disk drive. He told me to format it as a FAT32 file system, then re-boot the GPS with Home running, and it connected to Home on its own. Now, selecting Update downloaded and installed the basic system. A second update downloaded the map.

This restored the device to where I was when I started to revive it. Since it still wouldn't find a GPS satellite signal with all the software re-installed, the conclusion was, as I originally suspected, a hardware problem with the receiver, which couldn't be repaired. Even though my TomTom couldn't be brought back to life, I'd like to give a nod to Jawad who spent time on the phone with me. He was patient, understood my problem and what I had done so far to solve it, and gave me clear instructions as to try one more final approach.

I think I'll have some fun with it and try to take it apart. It's too small to be a doorstop and too big to be a paperweight. But thanks for the help along the way.

 

[canderson]

If nothing else, there's almost always a market out there on eBay for a decent LCD/digitizer.

 

[Arno]

Since it still wouldn't find a GPS satellite signal with all the software re-installed, the conclusion was, as I originally suspected, a hardware problem with the receiver, which couldn't be repaired.

On danger of stating the obvious, you did take it outside where there were no obstructions.

As posted here some time ago, my 930 was always up but one morning, in the Adirondacks, it took 25 minutes driving from Lake Placid to Saranac Lake until I had satellite acquisition.
Didn't happen before or after.

Take it with you, powered up on a longer drive before opting for canderson's suggestion to list it on eBay.