TT Rider won't follow a downloaded route.


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RIDER MDL 4GD00
Have created whole routes on Tyre and downloaded them to my new TT Rider in both Tyre and
TomTom format. When I go to open and use them, TT won't follow the waypoints. Instead it decides to plan its own way to the destination. Not what I want it to do. :mad:

I go to "Manage Itineraries", open the downloaded route, TT validates it and lists the correct waypoints; then when I press "Start Navigation" it asks me asks whether I want a fast, quick or a winding route and starts to PLAN it's own route to the destination. No..I want it to follow the waypoints in the downloaded route, not make up it's own way, but it refuses. Sometimes it even tells me to turn around and go back to the starting point while underway or dart off on some farm road. Maddening when you are on the road!! Why does it do this? Is this thing screwed up or am I missing a step or doing something wrong? At a loss. :(

Must admit I'm new to the TT Rider and haven't found any helpful step-by-step instructions for this model of the TT Rider either, so am feeling my way. I bought it primarily to use for long trips I design myself and that others have made up and downloaded from magazines and websites. I save them in both Tyre and TT format and have tried them both...but Rider seems to ignore what it's given and makes up it's own path. Have tested it several times. On this feature it has failed me.

If I'm doing something wrong would appreciate any advice and help so I can't get it to work right.
JonB
 
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canderson

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@robert
Need clarification:
Does the Rider actually hit all of your waypoints, but takes routes that you did not expect to achieve each of them, or is the device not even attempting to hit all of your itinerary's waypoints?

Hoping to clarify how this works, in case it helps:

When a TomTom is given an itinerary (*.itn) to follow, it will choose what it believes to be the fastest route, shortest route, or whatever configuration it's set to employ in routing. The ONLY way to force a TomTom along a very specific route is to increase the density of your itinerary waypoints such that its logic believes that it must follow your route in order to achieve the fastest or shortest or whatever route between one point and the next. Let me give you an example that may not apply here, but illustrates what can happen:

Let's say that you plan a route whose waypoints are all along a frontage road that parallels an interstate highway. It is likely that many of these waypoints, though on the frontage road, can be more quickly accessed by jumping onto the interstate between them. The only way to avoid that is to add a couple of intermediate waypoints on the frontage road so that the logic sees that there is no point in trying to use the interstate to gain time.
 
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RIDER MDL 4GD00
Thanks for the response, dhn .
On the bottom of the Rider device it clearly lists "MODEL 4GD00" but the link you provided came up with ;'4GB'. Hope that's the right one.

Is the guide in the link you sent the right one for this device?
JonB
@robert
Need clarification:
Does the Rider actually hit all of your waypoints, but takes routes that you did not expect to achieve each of them, or is the device not even attempting to hit all of your itinerary's waypoints?

Hoping to clarify how this works, in case it helps:

When a TomTom is given an itinerary (*.itn) to follow, it will choose what it believes to be the fastest route, shortest route, or whatever configuration it's set to employ in routing. The ONLY way to force a TomTom along a very specific route is to increase the density of your itinerary waypoints such that its logic believes that it must follow your route in order to achieve the fastest or shortest or whatever route between one point and the next. Let me give you an example that may not apply here, but illustrates what can happen:

Let's say that you plan a route whose waypoints are all along a frontage road that parallels an interstate highway. It is likely that many of these waypoints, though on the frontage road, can be more quickly accessed by jumping onto the interstate between them. The only way to avoid that is to add a couple of intermediate waypoints on the frontage road so that the logic sees that there is no point in trying to use the interstate to gain time.
 
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Thanks for the explaination. Now I understand why the routes I download from various motorcycle magazines (usually in GPS format which I assume is the Garmin format) are loaded with waypoints, often so many that TT won't accept some downloads until go back into Tyre and remove a few of them. Now that makes sense to me. Maybe that is why TT won't follow the exact routing I download into the device.

No, I must say that it does not misbehave on all pre-planned,downloaded routes, the short ones around my local home area in particular. But on the longer rides, what you could call 'trips' or Sunday rides, it does. That's what has me so stumped.
It will re-create the segment to its liking but will sometimes use a few of the original way points if they fit into its own routre planning. At other times it will re-plan everything from start point to end point. That's what's so frustrating, especially when I'm on an trip, in unfamiliar territory. Did that to me yesterday on a route someone else created which I wanted to follow. But TT ignored the plan and made up it's own. Granted, I got to the destination, but not as expected.
I even tried breaking a route up into separate segments, but TT still does not like to follow all the waypoints included in them. Can't help wondering if anyone else has experienced this problem.

Am wondering why, when I open a route and press "Start Navigating" it asks me to chose fastest, shortest, windeyest, when all the waypoints are already there? I assumed it would not need to go through all that since everything was already done and all the points were there.

Also am now wondering if I should cram lots of waypoints into the routes I plan on Tyre since you explained that they help keep TT on track. And BTW, how do I add a waypoint after a route had been created? Can it be done or do I have to start over from scratch?

Any thoughts on that idea as a possible solution, or do you think I'm missing some step?
JonB
 

dhn

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You best call Customer Service. I'm out of my element here.........
 
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Arno

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I thought you just add a new one with TYRE, save it with the same .itn name and put it on your device.
 

canderson

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Thanks for the explaination. Now I understand why the routes I download from various motorcycle magazines (usually in GPS format which I assume is the Garmin format) are loaded with waypoints, often so many that TT won't accept some downloads until go back into Tyre and remove a few of them. Now that makes sense to me. Maybe that is why TT won't follow the exact routing I download into the device.
Don't delete those extra ones! You can create as many *.itn files as will fit in memory in your unit. If using Tyre, break your longer route up into two or more itineraries, and after completing one, start the next. That way you'll have all of the density of waypoints necessary to keep you on your desired route. Then, when asked by the unit how you wish to navigate, always select "Shortest". That should force routing between your more densely packed points regardless of the time involved.

Also am now wondering if I should cram lots of waypoints into the routes I plan on Tyre since you explained that they help keep TT on track. And BTW, how do I add a waypoint after a route had been created? Can it be done or do I have to start over from scratch?
TYRE will let you add a waypoint to a list (Waypoint tab / Add), and with up/down arrows at the top to the right of your waypoint list, you can position it into your list wherever it belongs. The moving-by-arrow process can be a little tedious since TYRE isn't the fastest app out there, so you will find it easier to go to Tools / Preferences / Adding waypoints and select the box for "Below the currently selected waypoint". That way you can insert them directly into their correct location in the list.
 
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That makes sense. The more waypoints the better the chance that TT will be forced to follow a prescribed route if I select "Shortest" path. Many thanks for the tip. I'll revise a couple of my downloaded routes and give that technique a test run, probably on a ride next weekend.

You are right about the difficulty of inserting new waypoints. Having a rough time in Tyre but did manage to insert a few new ones. It is really tedious! Any tips on where waypoints should be placed or how far apart?

Two related questions if I may:
1. Is there a limit to the number of waypoints that TT will accept in any one route?

2. Does it matter which *.itn format a route is saved in: i.e. Tyre, TomTom or GPS? Or does the Tom Tom program handle each one equally? I would assume it would prefer all to be saved in Tom Tom format.

Thanks so much for your help, Canderson. Am much obliged! Do hope the info will clear the problem up as I'm looking forward to some out-of-state trips into unfamiliar territory and need TT to reliably follow a prescribed route. So far, when I have asked it to get me back home it has done so successfully, so I have no qualms with that function of the program, just the problem of following a pre-set path. Maybe this will do the trick. Will try out your advice and let you know the outcome. Thanks again.

JonB :)
 

canderson

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How many are needed depends a bit upon how much shorter, faster, or whateverer the unit thinks it can make the route after seeing your itinerary points. The example of paralleling a major highway is the sort that requires the most.

1) 48 points, if memory serves. After that, start another *.itn
2) You want to save the itinerary in TomTom *.itn format. Tyre's native format isn't even *.itn.
 
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Great! Now to give it a try. Will let you know if the problem is solved.

Again many thanks for your help!

JonB
 
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Arno

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That makes sense. The more waypoints the better the chance that TT will be forced to follow a prescribed route if I select "Shortest" path.
I suggest you open TomTom's Route Planner in a separate tab.

http://www.routes.tomtom.com/#/map/?center=43.666702,-79.4167&zoom=9&map=basic

Drag the map to see your stating point (last waypoint), right click and click Start here. Now go to where you think the next wayoint should be and click Finish here.
This is how TomTom determines the fastest route. If this coincides with how you want to drive you will not need to add an extra waypoint.

One caveat on shortest route. It may guide you through an industrial or residential area instead of a scenic route. In that case, just like with fastest, additional waypoints are needed.
 

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