TomTom 2535M Live HD Traffic

[badboy38]

I upgraded from a Go 740 Live unit to the new 2535 Live a week ago and have noticed what seems to be an issue with the traffic reporting. On my old unit, if I happenned to check traffic on the internet, say on google maps, and noticed patches of traffic on my route that were displayed iin yellow or red, they'd both show up on my Go 740 Live when driving the route. On my 2535, yellow traffic areas dont seem to show up. The RED (extreme) areas of traffic show up though. Anyone else noticing this? In fact, often I'll press the Show Traffic on route option on the 2535 and it'll show a map of the route and will indeed show patches of yellow traffic on my route that I am either already driving through or approaching, but that same traffic doesnt show on the main navigation screen like it does in red traffic areas. I realize that it's early into the release but thusfar it seems LESS accurate than my 740 Live was... Hopefully the yellow (slow) areas will be reported on the navigation screen in an update. I'm hoping so anyway.

 

[mvl]

I don't think the traffic is missing, there is a bug in the interface.

The GO740 traffic showed:
- yellow = light traffic
- orange = medium traffic
- red = heavy traffic

Recently, routes.tomtom.com implemented a coloring change:
- orange = light traffic
- red = medium traffic
- dark red = heavy traffic

It appears Tomtom goofed in implementing it in the GO2535LIVE. The navigation view, with the traffic sidebar on the right, uses the new routes.tomtom.com colors. The browse map view uses the old GO740 colors.

From what I can tell, the same traffic is on both devices, on all screens. It's just a coloring bug.

 

[badboy38]

2535 HD Traffic Issue

Ahhhhh. That kinda fits what is happening. Thanks for the reply. I still think that there may be something else going on because when I'm actually sitting in pretty HEAVY traffic, the navigation screen shows nothing, not even medium traffic. Just the regular red "follow this route" shading as usual instead of the little "arrowed" and color coded path showing traffic. So if the traffic is heavy and the new 2535 is supposed to display that as dark red, why would it show as "orange or yellow" when you select "Show Traffic on Route" instead of red or dark red on that screen? Im not sure if it's a software bug or bad information coming from their sources. For example, when I arrived at work after getting through the traffic on my route, I pulled google maps and bing maps of that same area and neither showed RED for that stretch of highway (approx 6-7 miles) although stretches were literally going 10-15 mph. They both showed yellow instead (bing and google).

 

[offthegrid]

This is a problem since if TT is only using their own probes someone using a TT has to be stuck in traffic to show it.

 

[Andy_P]

This is a problem since if TT is only using their own probes someone using a TT has to be stuck in traffic to show it.

But they're not... The GPRS signals (from Vodaphone users in the UK, not just TomTom users) is only one of the data providers they use. They also get traffic info form the more usual sources.

 

[mvl]

Badboy38,

One thing unique to Tomtom is that they have IQroutes historical time-of-day/day-of-week traffic already embedded in the map. The HD traffic server knows this, and only reports traffic if it is slower than the predictable traffic.

It's quite possible that the Tomtom knew of the 15mph traffic via IQroutes, and therefore no delay would be colored on the traffic bar or on the map. This predictable delay does impact routing, arrival time estimates, and the total delay number on the upper right corner of the driving screen.

The best way to confirm this is to see whether the arrival time estimate changes as you drive through the jam. If not, than the traffic was predictable and known.

Andy_P,

Another cross-the-pond difference is that there is no cellphone probe data used in the USA. They use some other undisclosed source, in addition to speeds of any LIVE edition of a Tomtom PND or iPhone app. The lack of cellphone data should mean that USA traffic would be less reliable, but I still find it amazingly reliable from whatever source they've got.

 

[badboy38]

Traffic

Hmmmm? Never thought of the possibility of them incorporasting the IQ routes in so maybe that's something new in terms of not displaying slow traffic. In my case it was on the heavier side so I would think that they'd give a visual confirmation of heavier traffic instead of it being "predictive" when it's that slow and backed up but who know's. I called TomTom support to inquire about the traffic not showing and they said in all honesty with it being so early into the release that they don't have all the answers just yet and would get back to me in a few days. I guess as I kinda expected it's part of grabbing anything that's brand new. You have to be willing to endure the early tweaks...I'll report anything new when they get back to me.

 

[mvl]

No matter how heavy the predictable traffic is, it won't be colored on the map as long as it's predictable.

Tomtom only colors in traffic that is more than normal for the day-of-week / time-of-day.

 

[jonstrong]

No matter how heavy the predictable traffic is, it won't be colored on the map as long as it's predictable.

Tomtom only colors in traffic that is more than normal for the day-of-week / time-of-day.

Apologies for jumping in the middle... I've never had a TomTom before, and am currently using a garmin 755t. The 2535m Live has caught my eye as a "next device", and Live / HD traffic combined with IQ Routes sounds very appealing (as long as the rest of the features satisfy).

Per your comment above - sounds like you can't count on the map to show you where congestion is when a road is normally congested (at least if time of day matches). I *do* appreciate the idea of showing exceptions to normal traffic. However I also travel to a number of cities in a given month, many of which are first time visits - and I wouldn't know if a road is usually slow or not. I imagine ETA will be correct, but I just won't have any idea if there's a problem up ahead, will I?

Thinking it would be nice to have an option to display traffic slower than posted limits - whether or not this is typical for a given time of day, and let the user decide whether this is shown.

- Jon

 

[gatorguy]

That was one of my complaints about the way TomTom shows traffic. If it's predicted by IQR it doesn't show you. If you regularly drive an area, or if it's your hometown, that may not be any issue I suppose. But in my case I'm often going to cities I'm less familiar with to quote or survey jobs. When I have my "druthers" I prefer to avoid traffic congestion, taking a side road or alternate route if I'm not in a hurry. Tomtom live traffic may not show that metro congestion and I end up right in the middle of it.

 

[mvl]

Tomtom's designers had a different use model in mind. Tomtom routing will evaluate the duration and speed of every predictable and HD-reported jam, and determine if it's better to go through or around the jam. They assume, when there's traffic, that their routing engine is good enough to just blindly follow it's directions.

With IQroutes and HD traffic, they're right. At least 90% of the time, an HD-traffic equipped Tomtom will route you at least as well (and usually better) than the most seasoned local-knowledge cab driver would know. So even if you're in a brand new city, you really don't need to know the predictable traffic, just trust the Tomtom.

This is a very different mindset from owners of other brands like Garmin. With other brands, you want to see the traffic and think through better / more appropriate routing, and it happens so often that needing to see the traffic becomes a habit.

I agree with Gator, that if you'd rather always avoid traffic, even if it takes longer, then the Tomtom doesn't help you very much. I just want to get to my destination as fast as possible, so I'm fine with Tomtom's visualization.

 

[jonstrong]

Ah well...I had a couple of hours free (rare occurrence!) and drove over to BestBuy. No intention of paying list price there...just wanted to try out a few GPS's "live" and see how they felt. They had two 2535m Live's in a cage - hadn't put out a display unit yet - but I talked the salesman into opening one for me to try out. Very nice, and I verified that I had 30 days to try it out, play with it and return it with no restocking fee if I don't like it.

MyTomTom seems a bit flakey, but seems to be working now as designed. Will be nice when they add the missing features such as voice download -- but the current voice is OK for now. Voice recognition actually seems to work well for me, I tried navigating a few routes from 50 to 150 miles, and it seems to work well.

I've sitting in my basement office now, and pleased to note that not only does the GSM chip get a good signal down here (I can play with live services), but I even have a GPS fix - and it appears to have me located perfectly. Nice!

I picked up their second generation "beanbag" dashboard base (smooth rubbery pseudo-leather surface instead of ballistic nylon). Seems comparable to the beanbag base I had from Garmin.

Too tired to drive now, but will give this a whirl tomorrow...

- Jon

 

[rrpnd]

mvl,

I'm with you and like the model TT is using for traffic. I don't want to be constantly checking traffic and trying to come up with alternative routes in areas in which I'm not all that familar just to make sure I avoid it. I just want to know that the route I am on is the fastest. If I can avoid traffic great, but if a route with traffic is likely the fastest then I'll deal with it.

 

[jonstrong]

In the end, I've got to agree. Although I occasionally take a longer route to simply avoid nasty traffic, my objective is generally to get to my destination as quickly as I can. Totally makes sense that HD traffic + IQ routes would accomplish something like this, which is what I really need.

- Jon

 

[badboy38]

HD Traffic

I appreciate everyone's comments and opinions on this subject. No argument from me because I also prefer the fastest route and only want to be re-routed if the new route is faster. My only issue is that IQ routes are invisible to the end user and although I always trust that TomTom will create the best route for me, it wouldn't hurt to have a visual confirmation that there's traffic especially when you're sitting in the middle of it. Doesn't mean that I'm going to exit the highway and not trust the unit as a result. For me it confirms that the traffic is "known" by TomTom's sources and I dont have to feel like maybe they missed this traffic jam and consider taking a different route. Just my personal thoughts. I've been driving the same route to/from work for 25 years now so I have a very good idea of the usual patterns on the highways in question but accident related traffic isnt predictable and you always wonder if it's normal volume or some other unreported incident if the navigation unit doesn't give any indication of traffic.

 

[offthegrid]

I didn't realize that the op was from the UK. In the US they've said they are only using their own probes.

But they're not... The GPRS signals (from Vodaphone users in the UK, not just TomTom users) is only one of the data providers they use. They also get traffic info form the more usual sources.

 

[mvl]

I just gave HD traffic its toughest test, Friday evening rush hour, crossing from Queens into Manhattan and through to new Jersey. It was almost perfect, picking up every jam on both highway and sideroad perfectly except for one. It missed the 1 hour delay on the Broome St approach to the Holland Tunnel. The road was moving 1 mph tops, and I bet Tomtom filtered it out as unrealistically slow. Luckily I drove in NYC a lot a decade ago and knew better sideroad approaches, otherwise I'd be stuck for an hour.

 

[jonstrong]

Nice! I've done the Manhattan to NJ trip more times than I can count -- would have been nice to have this kind of support.

Had to work at my desk most of the day today, so I only managed to get a few short drives in to try out the PND. Having used my Garmin 755t for 3 years there's definitely a learning curve to get used to the command sequence, menus, etc - but it shouldn't take long.

Overall - experience has been very positive so far. No chance to experience HD traffic yet, but I really like the way lane guidance is handled. On the Garmin, the advanced junction view (don't recall their specific name for this) I would only see the enlarged semi-realistic lane images occasionally. Tomtom may not be a quite as photo-realistic, but the simulated lanes in the lane guidance view are great, come up far more frequently than what I had with my Garmin, and the blinking arrows make it incredibly easy to know where to go at a glance.

Additionally, the voice prompts are great, e.g., "turn left, then stay in right lane". I'm looking forward to having some more choices for voices than can speak street names, but for the moment, I'm finding the text to speech to be significantly cleaner than any of my old 755t's synthesized speech. The construction of the voice prompt phrases is also well thought out and very natural.

The few routes I've tried so far were navigated perfectly. On Monday, I'll try a longer trip - Princeton, NJ to Hanover, Maryland (suburb outside Baltimore). Traffic just north of Baltimore gets really bad in the evening rush hour -- should be a great test when I'm driving back home around 6pm...

So far so good...

 

[badboy38]

Traffic

Over the past week since my last post, traffic seems to be appearing more in the navagation window when it's a little heavier than usual. Originally I wasnt getting much of anything on the Garden State Parkway. This morning it avoided a 30 minute delay right on point and notified me of it immediately after turning the device on. Two minutes later it re-routed me as expected. Thumbs up. Last night it was spot on with the stretches of the Parkway that were slow even though it was not much worse than usual.

 

[offthegrid]

Each 2535M Live that gets sold is another live probe on the road.

Over the past week since my last post, traffic seems to be appearing more in the navagation window when it's a little heavier than usual. Originally I wasnt getting much of anything on the Garden State Parkway. This morning it avoided a 30 minute delay right on point and notified me of it immediately after turning the device on. Two minutes later it re-routed me as expected. Thumbs up. Last night it was spot on with the stretches of the Parkway that were slow even though it was not much worse than usual.